Friday, July 14, 2006

WARNING: Country To Burn By 6PM

Another piece of information by fellow blogger Raja:

ALERT: Swiss embassy in Lebanon has given Swiss nationals until 6:00 PM today to leave the country. They base this timing on the fact that the Israelis have given Hizballah until 6:00 PM to return the prisoners after which, they will effectively burn the country down.

This is only one hour to go. It's 5PM in Lebanon.

Update: Hizbullah is showering North Israel with rockets and tens are wounded and dying. Meanwhile, the Lebanese Health Ministry has declared that 65 Lebanese have died and 195 are wounded.

Saudi Arabia's statement yesterday that what Hizbullah is doing is far from resistance might just be a green light to Israel to eliminate the party's military base. That's scary because we are entering the unknown, an unchartered territory.

Update 2 - 5:35PM (Lebanon's time): Watching the UN live webcast of a UN Security Council meeting to discuss the situation in Lebanon. The Lebanese spokesman is speaking right now.

"Nobody knows how many rebellions, besides political rebellions, ferment in the masses of life which people earth."

87 comments:

Anonymous said...

Where was the 6:00pm ultimatum made by Israel? Can you please provide a news link?

Doha said...

no news link. just info flowing from someone in lebanon.

Anonymous said...

Maybe it's time for the Lebanese army to step in and dismantle Hezbollah? Just a thought.

Anonymous said...

I am checking on this information from a very reliable source. I will try to confirm this information. I'll let everyone know asap.

Suha said...

Only this on Future TV flashes:

* Hariri contacts Erdogan to stop the Israeli attack and lift the siege off Lebanon.

* Three raids on Mdairej-Dahr al-Baydar.

* Olmert specifies 3 conditions: releasing the 2 prisoners, stopping Katiosha attacks, and disarming Hizballah.

Shawn Wasson said...

Doha, if you are interested in doing an interview for Clear Channel Radio, please email me at shawnwasson@clearchannel.com Thanks in advance.

Karridine said...

The Baha'is don't want pain and suffering, but ever since Baha'u'llah was forced, in chains, to suffer imprisonment at the hands of "Muslims", there has been a terrible chastisement approaching the Ummah...

Anonymous said...

1000000 Katiosha misseles will not stop this apperation. Israel believe in our leaders and think that this war is a war of defence.

The best defence is offence, and I believe that the people of Lebanon feel it every day since Israeli soldiers are been take into Syria ot Iran from Lebanon/

Anonymous said...

Saudis would not be displeased to see Syrian capability, carried out through Hizb, curtailed. Still, that was amazing statement for them to release publically. Have not seen Jordan or Egypt make similar public statement though they share Saudi view.

Anonymous said...

All of you lebanese should be united, and your government as the central pillar in this resistance to disarm Hizbollah . You are seeking for peace, but Hizbollah is your nation cancer who dangers democracy neither the free world.

Anonymous said...

the smarts peoples of lebanon, dont let the Hezbollah ro return your country 20 years back in time, enough for the kiliing and suffering, you should demonstrate in favor of your country and not of the Hezbollah'stan country....
we ,the israelies, want peace and quiet . let us/help us bring it out......

Renée in the USA said...

DAMN! Oh how I HOPE that Raja's news is wrong!!!! I was just heading over here to post the URL to a very encouraging article over at Y'net. It seems that the Lebanese Government is slowly (yeah, I know, slowly) trying to take a stand! They may even be reaching a point to maybe begin moving troops down to the south. Here is the URL:
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3275469,00.html

You know, Egypt deported a Hamas leader yesterday, and I also read about Saudi Arabia's statement yesterday. I've been hoping that these stands of support by other nations, and their condemnation of Hizbullah, would help the Lebanese government take a stronger stand. Oh I hope that the 6pm deadline is wrong or is able to be pushed off. Negotiations ARE going on. King Abdullah has been seeing many officials, etc.

Stay safe!!!

Akendorf said...

For the Lenanese who want Hizbullah out:

1) Practically speaking, what would this look like?

2) What has been done internally to accomplish this?

Ziad said...

Girls and guys outside of Lebanon, are you able to reach your families in Beirut by phone???

I've been trying to call and send SMSs in the last hour, to no avail....

Suha said...

Security Council in an emergency session right now.

IDF warns Aita al-Sha'ab residents to leave the village in 2 hours.

Anonymous said...

You and all the muslems world must understand that we(Israeli pepole)give all the respect to our solgers and goverment. we are the strong country at middle east and we wont give up still the 2 solders that the crazy nassralla took will be back at ISRAEL!!
The lebanon pepole and syrian people will be under attak of our air force!!!!!

Suha said...

Ziad,

the networks are jammed. I have not been successful in reaching the family today, but a friend of mine kept pressing the redial button and eventually got through.

Good luck!

Anonymous said...

Suha said...
Security Council in an emergency session right now

Post a link to back yuor claims.

Yuval from Israel said...

Lebanon will not burn down.
Israel has no intention to destroy Lebanon but we have intention to herden your life in order to make your government take responsibility for it's own land and get it's army to the southern side of lebanon.
i promisse you if Lebanon start to move it's troops to the southern side of lebanon and fight Hezbollah, the Israeli army will immidiately stop attacking Lebanon and will join the Lebanonian Army to help them. it already happened in the past and it can happen again.

start protest against the ugly use of lebanon teritory in order to hurt israel.
israel will not be destroyed by it, but you will suffer. and you can feel it right now.

know what's best for you! stand up as a proud nation! stop Hezbollah!
start to revive Lebanon as an independent country!

Anonymous said...

as an american "safe" in my home, i can't stand the hypocrisy that our gov. and israel show every day, whatever they say, its opposite of what they claim,we are supposed to be the voice of reason and peace, why is it that we overthrow "week gov." and talk "diplomatic" means with north korea? They already have weapons of mass destruction, but we must "talk" with them? The usa is out of control, and so is israel, Why can't we leave "others" alone? We are creating what we claim to avoid. Please world, accept this americans apology, but our elections are "rigged"

Vox Populi - Agent Provocateur said...

Don't worry Doha. Nasrallah and the resistance have swore to defend the country until the last bridge is destroyed. I expect Nasrallah to be some bridge this afternoon to protect it with his own body. I doubt that such a great and courageous man would send son, friends and fellow countrymen to their death without taking part to the action.

Vox Populi - Agent Provocateur said...

Read well because it may be the first and last time that I write this:

Hurray to the Saudis.

Yehonatan said...

As an Israeli from Tel Aviv, I can promise you that the Israeli government is commited to save lives of innocent citizens. So talking about "burning the country down" is not reasonable. It's not going to happen. Only hizbulla headquarters are going to burn down.

Anonymous said...

stand fot your right to be a free country and kick this fucking nasrallashit

Israeli from Haifa said...

The reason KSA can afford themselves to say such things, unlike Egypt and Jordan, is that they don't have relations with us. Egypt is allways affraid to be portrayed as an ally of Israel.

Yuval from Israel said...

Are you sure that Nasrallah is protecting Lebanon???

how exactly??
by Syrian threats??
by killing your Prime Minister??
by getting your nation into war??
by making a fool out of Lebanon??

can't you see that the only thing he had done is Damage?!

Anonymous said...

Please world, accept this americans apology, but our elections are "rigged"

KOSsack or DUmmie?

Suha said...

Anon 10:37

I am watching it live. Israeli representative speaking:
"We are doing the right thing and if we succeed then Lebanon will benefit".
"The international community has a duty to help Lebanon become a soverign country".

Anonymous said...

Let there be peace and quiet.
May god protect the lives of those who were pushed into this turmoil: Lebanese civilians and soldiers, Israeli civilians and soldiers.
May the Lebanese people finally have a free Lebanon, free from terrorist organizations, leaving peacefully aside Israel. Amen.

- Israeli

kachumbali said...

16:51 Berlin, 17:51 Beirut time:

I am a German student who stayed in Beirut for the last two semesters, just came back to Germany 2 weeks ago, and I can confirm the evacuation order by the Swiss Embassy; foreign (European) nationals are to be evacuated in a convoy to the Syrian border, I received the emails via the German church in Beirut to evacuate; just chatting with someone in Jounieh, he's hearing planes heading over to Beirut, might be the preparation for the 18:00 ultimatum (if that exists, where's the link?)

Anonymous said...

lol religion

Anonymous said...

Get the Hizbollah out and then there will be peace in your country. You can't let minority gangsters rule your country. Why have you been silent for so long? Danny, London

Mary said...

Yes, as Suha said, there's no real link on the Security Council since it's happening live, but I've been watching it on CNN. Here's an article that states that the emergency session was planned for today: http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=worldNews&storyID=2006-07-13T234912Z_01_N1396079_RTRUKOC_0_UK-MIDEAST-UN-LEBANON.xml

Basically the Lebanese ambassador to the UN asked for a complete cease fire to end the violence, and the Israeli ambassador said that this is just a response to what Hezbollah started and promised to strategically target Hezbollah sites and not all of Lebanon.

Omer (israeli) said...

I hope the news is wrong, we did enoght damage as it is. I'm an Israeli, and understand that we can't leave safely till Hizbbula is disarmed, but i see no sense in hurting lebanon physicly of economicly. you sufferd enoght!
Syria is the real country to blame.
I hope you see better days.

p.s
i dont think that israeli life is worth more then anyone else

p.s.2
plaese visit my blog "israelinlebanon" which is inteded to create understanding.

lebanese canadian said...

Ziad, we weren't able to get through to our family. I hope you're able to. Some live east of Beirut and still have email access. They're worried about supplies though and how far reaching this will get.
Prayers for all in Lebanon.

Anonymous said...

6:01
Anybody home?
LOL.

Anonymous said...

Hi,

The way i see things is so, the only country in the middle east which israel doesnt have relations with and which i thought to be an prospective partner for future peace is Lebanon. after seeing it's failed leadership miss guide the nation to another war by failing to disarm the Hizbaalla i dont know if there is any more hope.

Anonymous said...

As an Israeli, reading this blog and the comments puts me in a conflict. I usually support IDF actions without giving too much thought to the people on the other side. But it really hurts to think that nice intelligent people like you are suffering. Stay strong. If you can do anything against Hezbulah do it if not hide and stay safe till it's over.

I also want to give you another perspective on the situation from the Israeli side.
When it's coming to going to war there is always a lot of internal quarels in Israel. In 1982 about half the nation was against it and still the outcome was'nt too pleasing for anyone. But today there is a large consensus on the issue. And when we agree amongst ourselves there isn't much the world can do to stop us, so don't expect this war to stop untill Hezbulah is disarmed and the soldiers are safely returned.

Peaceful Israelie said...

Dear lebanese neiighbours, We in Israel were very proud of you, when out to the streets after the outrageous murder of your dear prime-minister Hariri. This is the time to do it again... All of the world will support you in this act. I think this must be a turning point in the struggle of good (Moderate mulsims and christians) against evil (Radical muslims). Believe or not but you, Lebanese, can change the course of events since 9/11 and rise of extreme Islam.

Jarak Karibak...

Anonymous said...

Lebanon should follow decision 1559 of the UN. If they do not act themselves and ordering Hizbollah to move back, it is only obvious that Israel will attack. Move back to the international borders, just is Israel did 8 months ago, and war will not be necessary.

imad said...

doha, I wish you'd stop using such alarming headlines. I'm in lebanon, i've been following the news, and so far no news agency broadcasted such thing. such titles may have negative or misleading effects on people who count on your blog as a main source of info. regards.

Anonymous said...

(Top israeli official - ministry of war)It is now official.
israel us about to launch massive attack on lebanon with non-conventional weapon, weapon of mass distraction.
approxemetly at 18:30.

Zionist said...

Another Arabic lie...

There was no such threat. Israel has knoe desire to burn dowm Lebanon. The Israeli has no hate for the Lebanies people.

The problem is thay this time toy got to far. Israel Have left Lebanon, there is no dispute between the two countries, but you let for a an Islamic terorist organization to violate your sovereignty in south Lebanon, so you are responsible for this escalation.

You might choose: to live peacefully alongside Israel or to pay for your aggression.

It's not to late for you people: you better bring back the Israeli hostages and disarm the Hizballa or you would swim in blood.

It's simple as that.

P.S.

Nasralla is a bloody terrorist. He's a dead man walking (hiding must be better word).

And he know's that.

Good day.

Anonymous said...

"Anonymous said...
6:01
Anybody home?
LOL."

Moron

You are as bad if not worse than the dhimmies here

Solomon2 said...

Is there anything remaining to be lost if the Lebanese gov't splits and the majority endorses 1559 and demands Hezbollah disarm immediately?

Yuval from Israel said...

To the German student -
maybe you're a bit silly, but the Europians evacuate every embassy in every nation that get's into a war.
do you really believe that israel is going to burn down Lebanon??
have you got a brain??

For your information, israelis and jews are not burning people Alive.
we are not Europe of the 20th century.
so far i don't remember your nation to be so peaceful with the ones who attack her.
neither France or Britain.
so stop believing those stupid things.

if israel wanted to it would long time ago destroy Lebanon. but we're not animals! we seek justice and peace but sometimes war is inavitable like this time.


and just like the Israeli prime minister words - " we will leave Lebanon only if it will take responsibility for it's teritory and remove Hezbollah from our borders".

Anonymous said...

people of the world or any body hwo reads this its time to stand up against teror of any kind its well known thet most of the people wants peace so take a stand and do something to take the hizballa out of your country rais your vioce becaus our goverment can be fanatic to bring back the kidnapt soldirs and to take out hizballa from our borders but most of our people wants peace me to
so i wish to all of us that this fighting will stop as soon as possible and our boys will be back soon peace to you all

Anonymous said...

I see no report of no ultimatum. Anyone can confirm?

Anonymous said...

"
Anonymous said...
(Top israeli official - ministry of war)It is now official.
israel us about to launch massive attack on lebanon with non-conventional weapon, weapon of mass distraction.
approxemetly at 18:30.

11:11 AM
"

No links makes you a Liar!

Ofernicus said...

Interesting... A whole bunch of international news sources as CNN, BBC, etc. don't even bother mentioning the Israeli soldiers Hezbullah kidnapped as the source of the current mess we are all in, it is suprising to find such a recognition in a Lebenese blog...

By the way, I got here from an article in an big Israeli news site...

CatoRenasci said...

Sports fans, when the Swiss call for evacuation of their nationals, and the Europeans are going to be convoyed out, you know the balloon is about to go up.

The Middle East has not seen a real European-grade War, the kind where very competent modern armies have far-reaching objectives that they believe national survival requires their achieving regardless of the cost - to their own troops, the enemy and, regrettably, to civilians.

The closest examples are the Syrian reduction of Hom and the Russians in Chechnya. Both examples were very localized. But, understand, Israel is fully capable of doing the same, and far worse, to Lebanon, and has every right under international law to pursue the objective of the destruction of Hezbollah, by whatever means (other than WMD unless they're used on the Israelis first) necessary. Eradicate Hezbollah root and branch, every single armed member, and every avowed supporter: dead or surrendered.

God preserve the Lebanese people who do not support Hebollah, they will need His protection.

Anonymous said...

the ultimatum has expired.
15 minute to lebanon....
14 minute and 50 seconds...
14 minute and 40 seconds...
14 minute and 30 seconds...
14 minute and 20 seconds...
14 minute and 10 seconds...
14 minute...
13 minute and 50 seconds...
13 minute and 40 seconds...
13 minute and 30 seconds...
13 minute and 20 seconds...
13 minute and 10 seconds...
13 minute..and so on...
lol lol lol lol lol...mmmoooooaaaaahahhahahaha

kachumbali said...

@yuval:

I am not stupid, I just wanted to confirm the information for the call to evacuate today at the given time in this blog. I am not suprised that foreign nationals are evacuated, i used to work in a German embassy myself. I know the procedures. I have lived 11 years in East Africa, 1 year in Lebanon, I know the situation out or Europe very well.

Don't start with history, this is not the place, and I could name a few 'terrorists' who founded a country in 1947 and later became its leaders.

I do not deny Israel its right do defend itself against any attack, even bomb Hezballah positions if that should be really necessary, but destroying infrastructure on this scale is not proportional!

Anonymous said...

Israel is the only country who has to operate within such hypocritical guidelines. They drop leaflets warning civilians of oncoming attacks. Has anyone ever cared about Israeli civilians when they attack us? The thing that makes me laugh the most is that people sit there and say that the Israeli's stole the country etc from the Pals...How many people are living in a country that was not won in a war????

Not only that but Israel never threw out the Pals they invited them to stay. The fact that they mostly ran away and then later decided to play victim is noones fault but their own. Resorting to terrorism is cowardly and shows that they dont care about their own citizens, due to the reprisal it always provokes. I am not even Jewish and so have no emotional attachment to the situation but I do have some basic intelligence and can see that while the lovely so called human rights activists condemn Israel, the people they are defending are stocking up on arms to bomb every western country in the world. Wake up people. I hope Israel smashes their terror groups so badly that they can never operate again and let that be a lesson to the other terrorist cowards. As to world opinon, I would like to know where restraint was shown after the 9/11 attacks and how world opinion counted then when America picked their targets.

Yuval from Israel said...

not proportional??

desrtoying runways of the international airport is not proportional?
or the highways to Beirut?

have you thought about the fact the Hezbollah will try to get the Israeli soliders out of Lebanon just like it did with others?? for example to Iran?

the Israeli proportion is very very calm.
but if you look at the E.U. and the U.S. proportions to terror like in Iraq and Afghanistan then you'll understand what is the difference between an army that defend his people to armies who don't.

let's not talk about Russia, that's way out of proportion.
Or sudan.

but israel is so caring for the life of innocent people that we spred flyers over the places which we bomb, saying to the people there to leave befor we attack.

i don't remember any nation doing that no where on earth!

CatoRenasci said...

kachumbai:

What the Israelis are doing is isolating the battlefield - destroying roads, bridges and airport facilities, and closing ports is perfectly reasonble as a means of closing the avenues of resupply to Hezballah (egad, how many different spellings are there?). That's not disproportionate, however uncomfortable it is for the Lebanese.

"Disproportionate" would be a Vernichtungskrieg. OH, I forgot, that's exactly what the Iranians constantly threaten the Israelis with.

kachumbali said...

@yuval

well, Hezballah attacked Israel, and you're telling me shelling the north-south road, bombing bridges, destroying lebanese army checkpoints, power stations, a TV-station and bombing civilian suburbs is totally proportional? plus the total blockade of Lebanon?

If Hezballah wants to get those soldiers out of Lebanon, they won't do it with cars, they will do it on foot or on donkeys with somehting else. Do you think they are stupid? Don't you think they could have forseen that the main traffic arteries would be hit? They did not take a highway into Israel to capture the two soldiers...

Anonymous said...

It is high time for the Lebanese national forces to capitalize on the vacume and enter South Lebanon NOW.
From Israel

Israeli said...

God be with you lebanese, i know most of you want Hizbollah out , you got the basic intellegence to realize that Hizbolla putting the basis of democracy and the princples of living free (as the western world) under real danger.
you should unite and protest to strengthen your governmnet to take action and send lebanese troops to the southern border. stand up for your right to live free . .

wish you safe weekend (Israeli and lebanese)

Charles Malik said...

Doha,

You and Raja have been doing a good job so far, but this post IS TOTALLY IRRESPONSIBLE AND SHOULD BE TAKEN DOWN IMMEDIATELY!!!

We're handling the situation just fine in Lebanon. It's our friends and family abroad that are flipping out at the moment, and you just threw gasoline on the fire. I get phone calls from Germany, the US, Australia, etc. every few minutes telling me to get out of town. One of the sources I gave these people to read is this very blog. Not nice of you at all.

BTW, it's 6:40 and nothing's happened.

Yuval from Israel said...

"shelling the north-south road, bombing bridges, destroying lebanese army checkpoints" - in order not to let them move their arsanells of weapon, or the kidnapped soliders.

"power stations" - so they will have no communications between them selfs or foriegn hostile nations like Iran or Syria.

"a TV-station " - yes it was El-Manar Hezbollah propoganda t.v. station. a perfect target.

"bombing civilian suburbs" - those suburbs are the places where the Hezbollah members live. we have anyright to wipe those suburbs to dust, but we only bomb it".

to remind you in the past 6 years Hezbollah provoced Israel 5 times and we kept silent and threat them.
but this time they gone too far and they must pay.


so after all this Information which you can verify, do you still believe it is out of proportion???
what is out of proportion is the thurst of the west for the arab oil. that's why they don't stand for us clearly, cause if we truely were wrong believe me the E.U. would long time ago denny us and not declair that we're one out of the two most popular nations to become an EU member if we wish for.

Anonymous said...

The funnt thing is that the Israeli's are alling for the Lebanese army to do something against Hezbollah.
But in the meantime the Israeli's are attackking Lebanese army-checkpoints and stuff.

Is the israeli army schizophrenic?:-S

Anonymous said...

oh oops,
funnt=funny
alling=calling

Doha said...

I'm surprised that you're saying this LP. The IDF is hitting Haret Hreik and Dahyeh since an hour ago, this is based on what i'm reading.

I'm updating the blog every few minutes and i'm doing what I can sitting way far in DC.

You're actually lucky that at least your family and friends are getting through to you via phone. Becuase I can't reach my family and friends.

Anyways, stay safe.

Yuval from Israel said...

the army check point being bombed is to put pressure on your government to take responsibility for it's own land.

but i personaly don't remember hearing that the Lebanonain check points are being bombed..

and believe me the media here is showing everything in order to put pressure on the government not to rush too much because the Israeli Public is fed up with occuping lebanon.
stop making us a monster we are not here to kill you. that's the last thing we're trying to do.

kachumbali said...

@yuval

it is out of proportion, and it might get worse, retaliation is always the worst motive. Olmert has to prove himlsef and his governement, but he chose the wrong way. Admittedly he was in a bad predicament, and he had to choose sh*t over sh*t...but that's not the point.

I have never been in Israel, but I imagine the landscape to be pretty similar, and if you safely want to move people, just use a bike, or one of the zillions of small roads. Use a 4x4, and you might even get further. Use a donkey, and no sattelite or Apache will be able to track you or stop you, no matter what you are transporting.

The Israeli response is totally disproportionate, and if you are worried about arms: everyone has arms in Lebanon, the heavy artillery and the rockets are in the south anyway, so why bomb the highway? The airport in the Bekaa I can maybe understand from a military point of view, but there's one thing:

from a military standpoint things are very different than from a human and political point of view. No one will disagree with the fact that the US managed to smash Saddam's forces (both times) in record time, but did they win anything? Was it proportionate?

I am telling you, attacking targets all over Lebanon is a shameful act by the Israeli government and the IDF, dropping some leafelets telling people they will be bombed is sarcastic at best, and there is no justification for the countrywide embargo. If you want to get two captives out, do it on foot or one of the many mountain trails to Syria (if there indeed is an international conspiracy to get the hostages out of Lebanon, which is far from being a proven fact!!!)

The IDF is making a lot of innocents suffer, and they are making things worse. They are thinking in short-term tactical objectives, but the Israeli strategy is a total mess!!!

Solomon2 said...

The Israeli response is totally disproportionate...attacking targets all over Lebanon is a shameful act by the Israeli government and the IDF -

No, it's straight out of the Torah!

Yuval from Israel said...

so far from being true.

telling people to get out of their homes befor they are being bombed is a humanitarian way to prevent innocent people getting hurt for no reson cause if you live next to a Hezbollah member you should know that you live next to a terrorist and no good will come out of it. what is sarcastic is the use of terrorist by hiding in civil places that is a shameful use for a human to do!

Olmert doesn't have to prove anything he has the largest party in israel, we all chose him because be believe in him.
and if you look at the political map in israel you'll see that the left parties are much larger than the right parties so he has a full back up for retaliation but believe me no nation will allow it self to be attacked time and time again without respond not even beautiful Germany which i'm sure you view as a humanitarian nation.
to remind you Germany is actualy supporting us this time.

war is ugly, no coflict about it, civilians are getting killed but you tell me
what would you do if your country would have been attacked time and time again for no reason? and hundreds of missiles would have fall on your nation?
would you say - let's not hurt civilians on the other side and sit back quietly??

it's a war against Hezbollah and not against Lebanon, the problem is that the lebanonian government refuses to take responsibility for it's southern border with israel and allowed Hezbollah to arm it self over there.
now israel is trying to force lebanon to take it's army and claim southern lebanon to itself and place peace and order over there, what they haven't been doing in the past 6 years even after the UN resolution claiming them to do so.

CatoRenasci said...

The airport in the Bekaa I can maybe understand from a military point of view, but there's one thing: from a military standpoint things are very different than from a human and political point of view.

Two points:

1) The Israelis have publicly stated that the Beruit airport is used extensively to bring arms to the Hezbollah. Assuming their intelligence is correct, it is both logical and reasonable to close that airport to traffic.

2) It's quite true that the military perspective differs from the "human and political point of view" (as you put it). The latter may well inform the former and limit its options. However, when survival is at stake, one's concerns for the "human point of view" on the other side are subordinate to one's own survival, and one's concerns for the political point of view are never so great as to accept attack without response.

Hamas and Hezbollah started the current war. Those who harbored them cannot complain of any negative result of having done so.

kachumbali said...

@yuval

look, the fliers are sarcastic, they look humanitarian on CNN, but everyone who has half a brain in his head knows to keep away from 'important' installations. But there's the next problem: what are critical installations? Of course the IDF tries not to hit civilians, but a 1000 pound bomb or a misguided shell from a destroyer isn't as selective as weapons manuals and governments like to make us believe.

The use of civilians as shields is deplorable, and I have not mentioned all the crimes and actions Hezballah's comitted because no one in his right mind would agree with them.

Don't get me wrong, I support Israel in its defence against Hezballah, but my point is the proportionality. Even speaking from an Israeli point of view, I truely believe you are hurting your future prospects for peace more than ever. Do you truely believe that you can eliminate a party like Hezballah which is deeply rooted in some parts of Lebanese society?

The Lebanese governement can only be held responsible in a very, very rudimentary way. There is no effective governement in Lebanon, there never was any. Lebanon does not possess one single society, it is deeply fractured and fragmented. Israelis know that, or at least they should know that, the IDF has been in Lebanon long enough, and you have some excellent analysts of the region. I believe that the countrywide military action is seen as unjust by a lot of Lebanese. No one can just stand up and openly demand the Hezballah to be kicked out. They are a party which enjoy great popular support in some areas, and a hostile attitude towards them would be seen as treason in these times, under the attack from a foreign army. Why do you think the Palestinians keep coming and coming and coming, dying by the scores while attacking the IDF instead of their own incompetent or extremist leaders? If you feel threatened, you stick together...

Speaking of UN resolutions, they are quite a few calling Israel to liberate the occupied territories, but the sttlement policies continue nevertheless, and these resolutions date back to the late 40s...resolutions are paper after all and cannot force anyone to do anything they don't want to, or are not able to (in the case of Lebanon).

Anonymous said...

Spinone one says:

War is not a proportional thing. All airports are automatically military targets; Lebanon only has three or four airports with paved runways. Infrastructure, bridges, power stations, communication centers, etc., are legitimate targets. Lebanon has known since the Israelis left in 2000 that it had to regain control of the south from Hizbollah. If failed. So, sometimes, harsh consequences flow form neglect and incompetence.

Yuval from Israel said...

this resolution is not from the late 50's it's from 2003 i think, from the very recent years, and don't dismiss UN resolutions cause they're the one who led to the pressure on Syria to withdraw...

i don't say that hurting innocent people or facilities are good.
but it is inevitable.
and why?
cause the Hezbollah use it.

and yes it is possible to take out Hezbollah, now that it's legitimacy is low it's better.
and just like the Syrian withdraw, the Hezbollah has to go.
today anything can happen, and i don't need to tell you that..
exactly like the israeli withdraw and the Syrian withdraw the Hezbollah has to withdraw and i believe it has less support than the Syrian control over lebanon, and even though you got to a point when Syria left Lebanon.

just like the Israeli song for peace -
"don't say the day will come, fight for it to come".

Yuval from Israel said...

Let's all hope that Nassrallah had died in the recent attack on Hizballa HQ...

his the one who led both of us - israelies and Lebanonians to fight :(

Pierre /Candide's Notebooks said...

Israel, being "humanitarian" before its bombings? Lovely reasoning. Just lovely. No wonder the perspective of those defending Israel's savagery is as craven as Hezballah's fanaticism. The two sides keep complimenting each other at Lebanon's expense.

Yuval from Israel said...

no, as an israeli i truely feel so sorry that this is the way we need to go.
the only way i believe is the resonable good people to make peace.

let's all hope the day will come and peace will take place in our regious and no more death to no israelies or lebnonians and all the other region of the middle east.

kachumbali said...

@yuval

I am refering to UNSC resolution 243 (something in that range), if you want, look it up, it's bot from the 40's, you're right there, but I think from either the 50's or 1967...

Anonymous said...

So the American embassy personnel has already left and the Swiss and the rest will comply with Isareli orderts so the serious bombing can begin... The whole western world seems to be getting behind Israel as Willing Executioners.

Anonymous said...

So the American embassy personnel has already left and the Swiss and the rest will comply with the Israeli orders so the serious bombing can begin... The whole western world seems to be getting behind Israel as Willing Executioners.

Anonymous said...

nasrallah just went on TV saying basically "you want to take it to the next level, hizbollah will take it to the next level"
The military operation has become a full fledged war ...
An israelian naval ship is sinking.

Anonymous said...

"An israelian naval ship is sinking."

Source?

Yuval from Israel said...

nasrallah took it first place to the next level, yesterday he shot at Hifa city for no reason again
let's not talk about more than 300 missile fired at israel in the last 60 hours.
unfortunatelly Lebanon didn't had the money to defend it civilians by building armored shelters like israel because through the years it been held hostage by hostil arab nations such as Iran & Syria,
hopefully this time hezbollah time is off and Lebanon will finally take responsibility for all of it's teritory, and no other nation will fight through it's soil.

just like one lebanonain minister said - Syria gives the order, Iran the equiptment, Israel responding, and Lebanon is paying.

Anonymous said...

Technically, Iran isn't an arab nation, but persian.

Jad J said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Jad J said...

Historically, They arent Arabs too...
but i have to add that some of us lebanese hate the fact that we are considered as Arabs just for speaking arabic. Coz after so much years of direct contact, we realized how different we are from them, mentally, physically hehehe and hygienically.

Yuval from Israel said...

LOL hygienically...
hehe

Fares said...

God Save Lebanon

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